Hi all,

This is Harun from Istanbul, Turkey. I have been following the forum for quite a while and thanks to you guys learned alot of things that saved me alot of time. I will be coming to Madrid in the next month or so and I have quite a few questions that I couldnt solve on my own. I thought I should ask you guys cuz most of you have gone through this stuff before.

As I wrote in the title, I am a Seppharadic Jew and I plan to stay in Spain for 2 years uninterrupted on a Student visa hopefully to apply for Spanish residency.

Surely this plan actually comes hand to hand with my other plan. Which is to learn Spanish for a whole year and then attend a good school for MBA.

I have read most of the threads about this and got answers to most of my questions.

Here's whats left on my mind,

1- I will most probably attend a whole year language course in a University, namely Complutense. Now after the first year I plan to attend an MBA and my hope if all things go well financially is to study at Instituto de Empresa the next year. My question is, when renewing our student residence do we have to continue studying in the same university or can we switch instituations and still get the residence extended?

2- The second one is if I were to study at Don Quijote for 36 weeks or so (that means it will be finished around april or so) will I be able to apply for an MBA in Instituto de Empresa that will start in September and be legal in the meantime?


Thanks in advance!
Harun

Harun--

A question: are you sure that student estancia (it's really estancia, not residency) counts toward your two years of official residency? I've read before that it has to be "real" residency and that the student residency doesn't count toward the years you need for citizenship. But I've also heard that it does count via the grapevine... Definitely something you'll want to nail down with a lawyer before you come.

About the two years.... when you get your student visa, request it for one year. You'll need to get some paperwork from a school saying that you'll be here for a year (you won't necessarily have to have paid for the school when you get your visa--it really depends on the timing of things and which school it is--for a big official university like la Complutense, you can only pay during the official matriculation time in late September).

Once you get here, you'll apply for your student residency the first month that you are here. Again, you'll want to do this for one year. After this, you can renew your residency every year and you won't ever need another visa.

Keep in mind that you don't have to be studying the whole time you are here--it just needs to look "full-time". I'm on my fourth year of a student visa and study in a normal Spanish program, which means three months off in the summer and several weeks off at Christmas. I know others who have gotten by on a LOT less... Of course given what you have to gain from doing it by the book (citizenship--lucky you!), I don't know if you should take any chances.

The residency is more of a pain the first time you apply. After that, the renewals are easier. For the visa and residency for the first year, you can get the Secretaría at Complutense to give you three reservas de plazo for all three trimesters of the language program--this should enable you to get the one year visa/residency.

For the second year, you might look into studying as an Alumno Visitante at Complutense. It's a LOT cheaper and you can take whatever classes you want (they don't count toward any degree--though if you decided to study in a degree program you could probably work something out with the profs to give you credit if you registered as a full student). Some facultades have classes in the afternoon, so it can be pretty flexible. When you renew the second year, they want to see your grades from the past year. One year I wasn't able to give them my grades (because they hadn't been issued yet), but they renewed me anyway... Most years I still have a few exams left to take in September (you can take them in June and/or September)--it doesn't seem to matter. I've never been able to give them the next year's matriculation, because at Complutense this happens in October and I have to renew in July or August. I think it goes even more smoothly if you use a lawyer to do the paperwork (toca madera--my papers are in en trámite right now).

You could also try going into a Masters program, but they are more expensive than regular studies (licenciatura) and alumno visitante setup, since the Masters aren't yet an official part of the Spanish degree system for most academic disciplines.

Also keep in mind that you can get the student residency with the paperwork from one program and switch to another one in midstream and usually get it renewed just fine.

I hope this helps--good luck and keep us posted.

Hi Mariposita!

Thanks for the insightful post! Actually I have also heard from an acquaintance in Spain that this student residency thing has a %50 chance of working , but I will ask a lawyer and also the Spanish Consulate in here to be sure. If this doesnt work then I guess I will have to apply for a residence visa which I have heard is much more painful than this one , and I dont know if it can be renewed or not.

So from what I understand, I should abandon the Don Quijote option totally because it is not a full year academic study. That means I will attend Complutense and then renew it for the next year but with that extended student card, will try to attend an MBA in a school I have chosen. Btw, do the Trimester Spanish Course also have exams and grades? That would be good because I could then show the grades as proof when applying to renew the student card the next year.. Having said that, I am planning to apply via Unispain as I have read very good reviews about it here.

Thanks again for your post, I will keep y'all posted on what's going on...

Harun

In the meanwhile I have found a site that talks about which residency is required for citizenship, here it is for anyone interested,

http://www.marbella-lawyers.com/index/questions/showQuestion/67

Hey Harun--
The Complutense program does have exams at the end and grades. My husband did it for a year and learned a lot (actually he only got grades from two out of three of the trimesters but ended up getting his visa renewed anyway).

That's the thing.... if you get the student residency for a year, then during that year, you can switch to another program if you want. It doesn't seem to matter as long as you can show that you were studying while you were here (this is based on our past experiences--of course things can change).

The other visa that you could try for is the non-lucrative one. It's not that hard to get as long as you have a certain amount of money in the bank (a LOT for the visa; less in a Spanish bank once you get here an apply for residency).

About the link officially the student permiso is called "estancia" and not residency. I think your best bet would be to talk to a lawyer here who has actually processed some of these and see what he/she says. We can ask our lawyer the next time we see him (I am wondering the same for our situation, though we have to wait much longer...)--I'm not sure if he has done any of these or not.

Just nosy... how are you going to prove that you are sefardí?

P.S. sending you a pm with a few tidbits that shouldn't go on the board.

Hey Harun--
I had my husband ask his lawyer about using student "estancia" to fulfill the residency requirements necessary to get Spanish citizenship. The lawyer said that this doesn't work unless you are able to get a real form of residency (work residency, non-lucrative, arraigo, retirement, etc.) after your estancia (and without interruption). In these cases, the years you spent as a student can be added to your years of real official residency (though this still sounds kind of tricky).

Now, of course, there may be some lawyers out there who have connections and can work bureaucratic miracles... But I think the law doesn't recognize estancia para estudios as a via toward getting citizenship (though after three years of continuous student estancia, you can apply for arraigo social and try to get full residency).

I think the non-lucrative visa (if you can get the funds together) is the easiest way to get your foot in the door.

HI my name is Bianca , and i want to have spanish citizenship, does anyone know exactly what that would be like for an american to go through the process?? My father is mexican and has a mexican citizenship and an american residency. would it be easier for me to become a spanish citizen if i became a mexican citizen first?? or would it take just as long?
I'm going to university in madrid and would like to live in spain after my studies. If anyone could help me out i would really appreciate it!!
Muchas gracias,
besos
Ciao

If you had Mexican citizenship, I think you only have to be a legal resident for two years to apply for citizenship (this is true of all Latin American countries, Portugal, and the Phillipines). As an American, you have to be here for ten years (going on memory here...). Student residency doesn't count unless you get a different form of residency immediately after your student residency (at least this is what our lawyer told us).

quote:

If you had Mexican citizenship, I think you only have to be a legal resident for two years to apply for citizenship (this is true of all Latin American countries, Portugal, and the Phillipines).

had lunch today with an couple of friends and one is argentinian. she said she can apply for citizenship after 1 year of legal res. here. maybe argentina gets a better deal than the rest of latin america due to its closer past history with spain?

saludos,
jer...

Ack, I tried to post and it went into the void... There are certain cases where you can apply for citizenship after one year of legal residency (no matter where you are from):

1. You are married to a Spaniard.
2. You have Spanish parents or grandparents.
3. You were born in Spain but don't have Spanish citizenship.
4. If two foreigners have a child on Spanish soil and are residents, their child can get Spanish citizenship after one year.

Everyone else (more or less) has to wait either two years (for former Spanish colonies, Portugal; Sefardís) or ten years (for nearly everyone else).

The laws are here:

http://www.mae.es/NR/rdonlyres/E49AA180-B25E-4973-AD5B-...nacionalidadpdf1.pdf

ahh thank-you mariposita and jer, i really appreciate the info.
well looks like i'm getting my mexican citzenship now,so that i'll get my spanish one quicker!!! lol
gracias
Bianca

Hey Bianca--
Good luck! I'm curious about how it works out... my husband's mom has Mexican citizenship and from what he found out, since he is an adult, he needs to spend some time residing in Mexico before he could get citizenship through her. Maybe your case is different (or the advice he got is wrong...). Like you, we're trying to work every possible angle!

Hi Mariposita,

I have just read your reply to me... Thanks alot for this!

As you said it sounds tricky to be on a student visa and apply for nonlucrative residence without interrupting the stay, but I will try to get more info about that anyways because it is 100 times eaiser than getting together 75000$ ..

And the time I ve got is goin less and less .. If I am gonna be there on a student visa for this year I should be there by 1st of October and that gives me only a month to have in my hand the Student Visa and tickets to Madrid .. Lets see what life will show

Take care,
Harun

Hey Harun

quote:

Just nosy... how are you going to prove that you are sefardí?

I'm Israeli, my hasband is sefaradi in origin
I'm very curious to know how are you going to prove it...
Nava

Shalom Navalee,

We have the rabbi organization here that maintains all the records of people who has immigrated from Spain to Turkey at its time.

So basicly I went to them and said my mom's side is sephardic... They asked me to fill a form , I filled it and I recieved a phone call a week later .. It seems I needed to make a donation of some sort to the Kizba. I still havent got the paper but I know it is there.

Let me know if you have any other questions about it,

Harun