To fill in the gaps, I guess...

� "hacer zapping" sounds more fun than "saltar de canal en canal".

� "cirujia est�tica para levantar la piel de cara" is waaaaay to long. Hacerse un lifting is "fashion".

� "hacerse un agujero en la oreja" or "agujerearse la oreja" sounds weird

Saludos,
jer...

I am one of the few living native english speakers who detests "Spanglish". It only seems valid to employ an english word for a new concept in the Hispanic world. If the rich Spanish language dosen�t have a word for harware for example, it is resonable that the language adopts the foriegn word, but when the language has words for hobby, like afici�n or pasatiempo, it is a shame that the mass media difuse such a nefangled introduction. There is an abundance of words that pop-culture has whimsicaly decided to burry, what a shame.

Sadly, often when one attempts to use proper RAE words there often is one of two reacions: the word seems execesively refined for daily usage, or the word has the very opposite conotation, one of a lack of culture. I know that this occurs in English as well. When was the last time you used betrothed? English has adopted countless words, but that dosen�t justify the tendency toward Spanglish. One of the more endearing qualities of Spanish is the generaly standardized usage that unites some 20+ countries, I hope that this common thread dosen�t unravel in the face of the growing English threat.

Purist of the world unite!

Hey shawn2, hmmmmmm, that "Purists of the world unite!" phrase sounds a bit farmiliar... ah yes I think it was heard quite a bit in pre WWII Germany

Can't stop progress my friend but I agree that the Spanish language is much too rich to have to use "borrowed words" when not necessary.

Another good example of what you are referring to with the necessary use of other words not yet in the Spanish language is the word "rastas" used here when referring to someone who has dreadlocks. "trenzas" (braids) are just not the same.

Saludos,
jer...

Jer, I was borrowing from "Workers of the world unite". There was a rally in the Puerta de Sol yesterday, and one of the young revolutionaries had a banner in spanish with the same message.

Young revolutionaries. At the puerta del sol. With Workers of the World Unite banners. Holy ****. What started that then?

quote:

I hope that this common thread dosen�t unravel in the face of the growing English threat.

Common thread?. This thread has been quite thought provoking in places .

As far as I can tell there are two cases why english words are used by the spanish (please note I am an engineer). They are:
1 ) The word does not exist in spanish (e.g. rastas).
2 ) It sounds cool to say it in english (e.g. camping).

I cannot see the solution to case 1. Once the new word starts being used how do you get everyone to use another specially when 2 always applies. I remember the french tried to come up with french equivalents in the IT world, the amazing example was 'bogue' for bug. Of course bogue is not an existing french word and just sounds stupid thus bug is still used. Nice try .

For case 2 I agree with others in this thread that spanish is rich enough that use of an english word is not required. But how do you make someone use the non-cool version. Using both would appear to be a compromise, thus appearing 'fashion' when needed but at the same time with the knowledge of having a good grasp of the language.

One thing that still puzzles me is why when adopting an english word it is sometimes the wrong one. Two prime examples are the football terms, 'el mister' (the coach) and 'el crack' (the star player). Why? Lots of other football terms have been assimilated and are easily traced (futbol, penalti, corner, gol, hooligan, ...).

And also the evolution of the word once in the spanish dialect. An example is snowboarding. When it appeared in spain it was 'hacer snowboarding', it then went on to 'hacer snowboard'. Currently it is 'hacer snow'. Can we expect it to evolve into 'hacer sno', 'hacer sn' or even 'hacer s'.

Saludos,

Ian

There was a rally against the Iraq war, which of course atracted the usual profesional protest crowd. I personally have problems with the US-Iraq policy, but was not ready to march along side the hodgepodge with their banners. I may oppose the US policy with respect to Iraq, but I am not anti-american.

Shawn2, I understand your sentiment, but lighten up a little. I'd like to see you argue your point to my 74 year old grandmother, never properly educated in Spanish, spoke it at home everyday and incorporated both her English and Spanish lives into one mix. All I could do was get a better education in spite of it.
Those "purist" thoughts really aggrevate me!

In no way would I advocate speaking Spanglish over learning proper usage, but some of the less educated (and educated for that matter) will still use it. And as this big world of ours becomes more of a "melting pot", we will be seeing more and more mixing of the languages for whatever reason!

Laduque,
I have found myself in a state of Spanish delirium, I am so passionate for any thing Spanish that at times my love of the language and culutre resembles zealotry. I compare my afliction to that of a recovering drunk who is eager to point out the evils of booze to anyone and everyone, in my case I wish to extoll the virtues of Spain every chance I can. Like all new converts, I am more sensitive to abuses of doctrine than are many native speakers.

I hope you understand where I am coming from with regards to my anti-spanglish banter. Besides, I am sure that your grandmother could "kickea" mi culo.

Shawn, I remember feeling the same way when I first returned from Spain 12 years ago. It does fade a little but never completely goes away.
Just remember, that everyone has an opinion, and I welcome yours.
REmember in Southern California, if you go extolling the virtues of Puro Castellano, you will be met with resentment, or worse yet, an angry chicano mob after you!!!
Not everyone has been fortunate enough to study abroad in Spain, but hey, who cares, as long as we can all communicate!!! Capiche?

Angry chicano mob , I better enroll myself in a kung fu course.

Sadly, what you say is true. So many of the "hispanohablantes" who live in southern California, equate proper Spanish with Hernan Cortez. They lack education in their puported first language, and they tend to resent those non-native speakers who are literate in Spanish.
It creates a difficult dilema: abase one�s knowledge of the language in order to placate the masses, or resist the dangerous tidal of wave of ignorance.

It is interesting, because we never see British speakers reviled in the United States. There usage is respected, without provoking any kind of reference to Gerorge III.