This is more of a Spain and World link, than just Madrid, though it certainly does involve Madrid. Check out this link: Infobel.com .

This is what I would call an invasion of privacy and not too cool of our good buddies and friends of Telef�nica. It looks like, if you have your 'land-line'(fijo) telephone service with Telef�nica that they've sold all of their clients' information to this Belgian company, Infobel.com. I tried clicking on People Finder and then on Reverse Search under the Spain section and, upon entering my own telephone number was given my name, address and a map as to how you could get to my house.

I'm all for staying in touch, but I think this would have be considered an inappropriate way for Telef�nica to 'make money' by selling their clients information. I don't believe that this is appropriate outside of Spain (or any other country) without client permission.

I don't see this on par with distributing a copy of your local white pages. Perhaps I'm overreacting, but that's been my initial reaction to learning about this. I guess, on the other hand, I'd probably really dig this service if I were a bill collector...

Tony,

You are right on target. I can only imagine the kind of abuses this would precipitate.

We had a similar problem here with our county. They decided that they would post property tax records on the web, searchable by owner's name, address, etc. So, someone who had excaped an abusive relationship and had gotten away, or someone being stalked, now had a much greater chance of being located....Sort of makes it pointless to have an unlisted phone number...

Luckily, enough people complained that the database can now only be searched by address. This is exactly how the books containing these public records are organized at the county courthouse.

All I can suggest is that enough people complain about it. Might be a good article for a local news reporter.

This is interesting ! In UK we have a service called www.192.com which used to be free but now charges but will provide oodles of information about individuals or businesses.

Even the mega British Telecom has a search enquiry www.bt.com which will provide full address and a map .

But isn't this what the world is now all about ? Xenophobia is old hat. The new age of the Euro. Breaking down barriers. Getting rid of queues ! Finding information fast.

If you want to hide then this is possible too, but becoming more difficult. And what about all those CCTVs that are springing up everywhere ? Don't forget that if you fail to get onto the Plaza Mayor webcam, you definitely WILL be photographed somewhere !

Big brother is watching you !

Nige

I don't know whether or not Spain has telemarketers (if it doesn't, I'll move there tomorrow), but we do and they are members of the only profession held in lower public esteem than lawyers. I have an unlisted telephone number, which reduces getting calls from these folks during dinnertime. Call it annoyance rather than xenophobia.

If Infobel enabled someone to enter my unlisted telephone number and get my information, I would not be happy about it. After all, I pay extra to have my number unlisted.

However, if the only phone numbers Infobel could access were those already listed in the phone book, it wouldn't be any different than all the other similar systems out there.

I don't quite get calling that xenophobia to be honest with you Nige. I guess you're referring to fearing something that is 'strange' or out of my norm...I don't see that as being the case here.

I'm a pretty busy person. I'm also a pretty open person. However, when I'm at home, I want to exercise my right to occasionally disconnect the computer, turn off my mobile phone and even disconnect the phone should I choose to spend time with my family... If that's hiding then ok...sometimes I like to hide.

The problem I have with what Infobel is doing here is that they give my number, address, a map if you want to come over. I think that infringes upon this right as I've just explained it above.

And telemarketers... you're right Paul. That's right in the same general category as lawyers...Unfortunately we do have them in Spain though I believe it's not as abused here as it is there from my viewpoint. Of course...thanks for Infobel, that could change.

I certainly don't believe I'm xenophobic of computers and technology in general considering my profession (IT Consultant/QA Engineer). I love technology, change and the future. However, loving these things doesn't have to mean that you lose the right to privacy though. That's the problem that I continue having with this.

OK but I don't necessarily think that Telefonica has sold anyone out. Maybe the European Data protection rules have given some increased scope for cross border sharing of information but surely all this must be regulated and if data is released 'illegally' then the lawyers will soon close it down. I would hope !

So I guess it's about personal likes and dislikes, which I agree is paramount. It really is infuriating to get unsolicited calls from salesmen or - if you have a fax machine - a spam fax wanting you to spend premium money on replying.

I also believe in the improvement of obtaining information fast. And if possible for Free !

Nige

No way!

There are 12 people with my last name in Madrid, and one right around the corner from me!!!

quote:

"Don't forget that if you fail to get onto the Plaza Mayor webcam, you definitely WILL be photographed somewhere!"

jejejeje, "big jer is watching!"

Paul, not sure how much telemarketing has grown in the U.S. but I rarely get calls from telemarketers here in Madrid. Maybe once every few weeks at most and it is usually the "pesados" from "Home English" trying to sell me a course to learn English at home and forgetting that I have told them 50,000,000,000 times that I am American, I already "speak English good" (if they were any good at their jobs they would catch that at call me on it).

On the other point, the profession of lawyer here is a rather respected one

Hiding is good, as long as you can always find yourself

I agree with tonytorero here, between the infobel basta... and the folks at http://fotos.qdq.com , eventually anyone will be able to find your house and pop on over

The services may be useful but, where should we draw the line?

Saludos,
jer...

p.d. hey, maybe I can sell the e-mail addresses of the over 700 message board members of mine to the highest bidder(s)

The telemarketing problem is somewhat annoying, but manageable. Having an unlisted phone number helps. Almost all telemarketers use automatic dialing systems, so when you pick it up, there is a lag of a few seconds before the telemarketer begins speaking. I take this as my cue to interrupt them with "Sorry, not interested. Thank you, goodbye." Then I hang up.

Those that manage to get through are usually asking for my wife, whose surname seems to be unpronounceable to all but Spanish speaking people. Ultimately, they butcher it and I can honestly say that no one here has that name.

FYI The profession of lawyer only becomes esteemed to a member of our general population the very instant he or she needs one :jeje:

Someone told me that Telef�nica mailed out a letter to its customers explaining that they were going to give out our personal information to businesses. Like the US, the letter had a phone number in which you could call if you didn�t want your information given out. I don�t remember getting this letter personally, although I do throw away a lot of junk....

I never got that letter, must have gotten lost in the mail

Update on infobel, now when you try and do a reverse search (ie find someones name and address by using their phone #), you get the following message...

quote:

"As a result of the ruling of the Spanish Ministry of Science and Technology, 711/2002, of 26th of March searching by means of telephone number has become prohibited.

We have therefore taken the initiative of suspending the functionality of search by telephone numbers on the universal telephone directory.

If however you wish to be kept informed in the case of the reestablishment of this functionality as a result of steps which we are now undertaking or if you wish to support us in the framework of these steps, please leave us your contact details here ( reverse_espana@infobel.com )".

So, looks like we still get some privacy.

Saludos,
jer...