Hola! I need some information on study abroad programs in Madrid. I've heard Saint Louis University is a good program but has a very small campus. I've also heard the Complutense is has a very large campus and enrollment but that the academics are not as good. Anybody ever study at either one and would be willing to share their experience? Thanks.
Posts: 17 | Location: Madrid | Registered: 19 September 2003
I've also heard the Complutense is has a very large campus and enrollment but that the academics are not as good.
Academics are EXCELLENT!!! I think those who told you otherwise may have mislead you due to their misinterpretation of their studies at the "Complu".
You see, SLU is an American University and has its program set up BY American and FOR Americans, making studying there very similiar to the way you would study in the USA.
The Complutense is a Spanish University and while the "Cursos para Extranjeros" may be geared towards foreigners, they are not necessarily set up along the lines of the USA university system.
The university system here is not nearly as "hold the student's hand" guided as it is back in the USA and many students who go to Spanish universities just can't handle the differnce.
The academics at SLU are not nearly up to the levels of the Complutense but the system is different.
I am an M.A. graduate of St. Louis University and took an M.A. course at the Madrid Campus the summer of 1999.
I agree with Jeremy's assesment. The systems are different, and although I'm not really familiar with Complutense, I can tell you that SLU's courses were not academically challenging to say the least. The SLU campus is embarrassingly small in my opinion, and the facilities - library, computer lab, etc. were bare minimum.
In my case this was actually better since I was there primarily to get by on the minimum effort and spend most of my time enjoying all that Madrid and Spain had to offer. If I honestly had to study in Madrid, I would have failed miserably. Too many good times to be had. :cheers:
If you have any specific question perhaps I could help. Suerte.
BTW, as an interesting side note, although SLU is a Jesuit University, the Madrid campus is managed by a Mormon couple.
Posts: 32 | Location: West Los Angeles, CA, USA | Registered: 25 December 2001
I attended the Complutense, as part of the Universidades Reunidas program. Universidades Reunidas is a consortium of U.S. university programs affiliated with the Facultad de Filosof�a y Letras at the Universidad Complutense. Reunidas courses, primarily in the humanities and social sciences, are taught in Spanish by UCM professors, but are designed for U.S. students. (Meaning, they were IMHO absurdly easy, I got nearly straight As without too much effort. Also, the students in the classes are all guiris.)
Pros
Courses were directly applicable to my home university (San Diego State).
My tuition fees were calculated as if I were taking a full courseload as a "resident" at SDSU.
"Startup" fees were low (SDUS is a public university): granted this was 15 years ago, but what we had to pay before leaving was about $2500, which covered tuition, flight over, 1 month in dorm, some excursions and holiday meals, etc.
Whatever else you spent was what you could " survive on" for the rest of the year and return back home (piso rent, food, flight home, school books, traveling, etc).
Because the cost was reasonable, we had students from a wider economic background than at more expensive, private programs. We had children of doctors and children of farmworkers.
Some unique classes, like "Art in the Prado Museum" 2 days/wk in classroom, 1 day/wk in the Prado.
Cons
Classes weren't all that challenging.
Most classes were "Humanities", which didn't help science, math, and engineering majors unless they could wait until their junior year (this was primarily a "junior year" program) to take their "Humanities" requirements.
Es este uno de los programas internacionales m�s antiguos de la Universidad Complutense, iniciado ya hace varias d�cadas por las Facultades de Humanidades. Supone la colaboraci�n directa de la Universidad Complutense con un consorcio de universidades norteamericanas y tiene como principal actividad el desarrollo de cursos espec�ficos para j�venes estudiantes de pregrado de estas universidades en la nuestra.
Las notables diferencias que existen entre el sistema educativo de pregrado entre las universidades americanas y las europeas determina la necesidad de un programa especial para estos estudiantes sobre humanidades y ciencias sociales relacionados con Espa�a y Europa e impartidos por profesores de la Universidad Complutense. Los estudiantes norteamericanos pueden as� desarrollar un �Study Abroad Year� con validez acad�mica a su retorno a los Estados Unidos.
En el momento actual, el consorcio de Universidades Reunidas est� constituido por:
Academic Year Abroad Boston College California State University (San Diego State, San Jose State, Cal Poly, etc.) The California State University (they meant Univ of Calif here) Universidad de Georgetown Indiana-Purdue-Wisconsin Universities Marist College Universidad de Marquette New Jersey State College Council for International Education Stetson University Tulane University Universidad de Vanderbilt >
"An honest man is always a child" - Socrates ...no wonder I'm so immature!
Paul, Are you telling me that you got SDSU credit for being at UCM? Did you go as an undergrad or as a grad student? I thought that with the CSU system you can only take 9 units. And did you have any admission problems with SDSU when you got back?
Posts: 331 | Location: San Diego | Registered: 14 December 2002
Jer: Are the academics at SLU-Madrid really that bad? If I'm correct, SLU has some top ranked programs in the States and I'm wondering if the Madrid campus is independent or if it has the same standards as the Missouri campus?
Rocinante: What kinds of classes did you take at SLU-Madrid? I take it the students weren't very bright or were just there to party. I don't think I'd fit in at that kind of school. Why would a Mormon couple manage a Jesuit school?
PaulandIrene: You mean that most students at SLU-Madrid come from an upper class background? I don't think that would be a good idea for me because they're probably all conceited and intolerant.
Posts: 17 | Location: Madrid | Registered: 19 September 2003
What would you want to study while you're in Madrid? How is your level of Spanish?
As far as academics go I think there's no doubt they may be better (even classes directed at foreigners) at Complutense because well, it's one of the leading univs in Spain I think. The SLU campus as mentioned before is just really a satellite. You're going to get the typical US college students just going to take the filler classes and party their asses off.
If you really want the big-mama challenge while you're there I suggest you see if you can enroll in regular classes with Spanish students. I mean you could mix and match maybe? Like take some classes in English and an introductory course taught in Spanish? You can also try Universidad de Carlos III in Madrid. That's a good univ. and they have some foreigners there as well.
It all depends what you're looking to get out of your experience.
"He who hath not a dram of folly in his mixture, hath pounds of much worse matter in his composition".
Posts: 334 | Location: New York, USA | Registered: 06 June 2003
What would you want to study while you're in Madrid? How is your level of Spanish? It all depends what you're looking to get out of your experience. [/qb]
I would like to study psychology. Have you ever taken classes at SLU and if so, what were they like? My Spanish is alright I guess. With a little help, I can hold a conversation. From the looks of things, it sounds like the complutense might be the way to go.
Posts: 17 | Location: Madrid | Registered: 19 September 2003
originally posted by sedusa: [qb] Paul, Are you telling me that you got SDSU credit for being at UCM? Did you go as an undergrad or as a grad student? I thought that with the CSU system you can only take 9 units. And did you have any admission problems with SDSU when you got back? [/qb]
Tevia, I was enrolled in SDSU and went to Spain as part of the Cal State University's International Programs. I was an undergrad but know of several grad students who were on the program. I had no problem with my credits transferring. And, I was considered an SDSU student while abroad so I didn't have to get readmitted upon return. I didn't think the classes were especially challenging, but really it's what you decide to put into it is what you get out of it. I thought the program was a good value. The director is different every year, but ours was incredible.
There is an International Programs office at SDSU which can answer a lot of questions. Here's the URL to what looks like the latest application: www.gateway.calstate.edu/csuienet/IPAPP04.pdf
It's an Adobe Acrobat PDF file, so you'll need the Acrobat Reader. (I'm writing this on my brand new Dell laptop and still haven't put Acrobat Reader on it yet.)
"An honest man is always a child" - Socrates ...no wonder I'm so immature!
I only took one class that summer: A teaching methodology class full of mostly already full time teachers from all over the US getting their M.A. in Spanish over the course of a 3 year summer program. I was doing the M.A. in St. Louis (hometown) and had different priorities at the time. The students in the class weren't by any means slackers, it's just that the course wasn't demanding and I didn't take much from it. It was mostly presentations of each teachers' styles and reading some material here and their. I was much more concerned with going out and meeting real Spaniards and living the Spanish way of life than studying pedogogy, which I could do at home and I wasn't necessarily going to pursue teaching anyway(which I still haven't by the way).
Any other undergraduate course work I'm not familiar with, but I have the feeling it is a bit watered down for US students and I've heard that the Spaniards that go their are those that can't really get into Spanish Universities. They do have to do a year abroad in STL, Missouri, which is good for their English.
Anyway, as far as Mormons, it leads me to believe that it was not as close to the hip in operation and philosophy as the mother campus is. More like a satelite with naming rights and credit transfer reciprocity. Not the worst place by any means to go to school, but remember it's small like I said. I would contact some SLU students who have done full semesters there; they would have a better impression than me as to being a full time student.
Posts: 32 | Location: West Los Angeles, CA, USA | Registered: 25 December 2001
Hey whats up Jer? No, I haven't looked into middlebury. I have looked at other schools outside of Madrid that are close to the beach like in sevilla, malaga, or granada and others near the coast. I'm not so sure Madrid is for me. WOuldn't it be difficult to study with all the noise?
saint louis madrid is not for everybody. I've heard stories about that place! A few people have told me that the place is a dump. That the students are informally segregated into groups based upon ethnicity and class. Not surprising since the school has its roots in Missouri "Missurah" a.k.a., "the South" for which it is notorious for that kind of thing. Spanish students refuse to take trips with the Anglos and such. I've also heard that Spanish students are treated as second rate. Seriously, I think I'll pass.
Posts: 17 | Location: Madrid | Registered: 19 September 2003
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- already have a cell phone, get a spanish SIM card for it at ![[Embarassed]](redface.gif)
Too many good times to be had. :cheers: 
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A few people have told me that the place is a dump. That the students are informally segregated into groups based upon ethnicity and class. Not surprising since the school has its roots in Missouri "Missurah" a.k.a., "the South" for which it is notorious for that kind of thing. Spanish students refuse to take trips with the Anglos and such. I've also heard that Spanish students are treated as second rate. 
Seriously, I think I'll pass.
