OK, I have a question about the use of the subjunctive after 'tal vez'. I thought that the subjunctive was pretty much required in this instance, like the use of 'quiz�' etc. However, a recent email from a Spanish friend confused me and I would appreciate it if somebody could help! :b:

Two sentences
1) Tal vez ma�ana sea tarde
2) Tal vez ma�ana puede ser tarde

Both are correct, both express probability (tal vez) but why doesn't sentence 2 read 'tal vez ma�ana pueda ser tarde'?

Am I reading into this too much?!?!!

I would appreciate it if somebody could clarify this point for me as it is driving me MAD!!

Thanks!

Hi Rucita1978...

quote:

"However, a recent email from a Spanish friend confused me and I would appreciate it if somebody could help!"

No offense to your friend but phrase #2...

"Tal vez ma�ana puede ser tarde"...

is gramatically incorrect.

It should be "Tal vez ma�ana pueda ser tarde".

So, problem solved You were right in your understanding of the subjunctive when used with "tal vez", it is obligatory in both cases, your friend simply forgot to use it on the verb "poder" in that second phrase.

You see, even if your friend is Spanish it does not necessarily mean he/she knows the rules of Spanish well.

Happens a lot.

Saludos,
jer...

Hmm...I beg to differ, jer. Being the Spanish grammar and linguistics freak that I am, I quote my grammar book:

The subjunctive is used in Spanish after acaso, quizas, and tal vez when the speaker wishes to indicate doubt. If the speaker does not want to express doubt, the indicative is used:

Tal vez sea demasiado tarde.
(Perhaps it may be too late)

Tal vez es demasiado tarde.
(Perhaps it is too late - I think it is)

Quizas no quieran ayudarnos.
(Perhaps they don't want to help us - speaker is in doubt)

Quizas no quieren ayudarnos.
(The speaker thinks they don't)

So to answer Rucita's question, yes, both sentences are grammatically correct. Hopefully you are not even more confused!


Mara

each time I THINK i understand the dang subjunctive you guys have to mess it up for me. Jeez, why does it have to be so hard for me!!! So, would I use teh subjunctive in that case since I am doubting my knowledge of Spanish? hehe

Jer,

I'm sorry, but I have to agree with Maratl2 with regards to tal vez.

While I was preparing for the DELE in Valladolid, it was made quite clear that the RAE admits both the indicative and subjunctive moods, and that Spaniards use both nearly indistinguishably. It is true that historically the subjunctive was soley used after certain markers of probability (e.g. tal vez, acaso, quiz�, and seguramente), this is still true in Portuguese, but with the passage of time Spaniards began also to use the indicative mood in order to express a slightly different nuance. In contemporary Spanish the difference between the two moods has been significantly blurred.

There are some very conservative linguists who do give preference to the subjunctive, just as there are some who prefer quiz� over quiz�s. Even among the great minds at the RAE, there are differing opinons on certain topics. Pehrps we should count you amongst thegreat conservative grammarians.

Much like Maratl2, I too have become a bit of a grammar nut. I try to read anything written about the beautiful Castillian language, although, I still make plenty of bonehead errors, practise makes perfect.

Saludos

Rucita,

You could say it both ways, but I’d rather just say: ‘Ma�ana puede ser tarde ya’ (no ‘pueda’ in this case, and ‘ya’ is completely optional). What I basically mean to say is that personally, I do not like sentence number two altogether. The use of ‘tal vez’ and ‘puede/pueda ser” in the same phrase sounds redundant (I know, I’m aware many people speak very “redundantly” these days; ‘a veces suelo ir a ese sitio’, what IS that? ), I’d go for sentence number two anytime, besides that way….your problem IS solved!

OK, I think I am a little clearer now . Thanks guys!! I knew I could rely on you!

I dont know about other Madrid/ Spain fans..but when it get to this time of year I really, really start to miss Spain- even more than I usually do, and I know this feeling wont go away until September. Surely that cant be healthy ?!