So I am in Malasaña in a bar last night when the place is stormed by under cover cops who give me a body search, squeezing my royal jewels unpleasantly, and tell me if this were America I would get a beating. Which, of course I told him bullshit considering the 4th would have protected me against any searches without evidence justifing the search. He just gruffed and let me go.

Anyway, does anyone know what the actual law here is on this? I'd like to know because I would rather get my ass kicked and win in court then consent to illegal searches.

IMHO. I really think that you should call immediately in the morning to the American embassy, and consult with them, explain exactly what happened, and what was done, how you was treated by the cop, and let them look into it & handle it.

If the "personal body search" that was carried out on you, was in anyway in contravention of your civil rights, the officers who did it could be in some pretty deep shit, but only the Embassy could realistically do anything about it, and I think that the best you could hope for is a letter of apology from the Police, but to push for anything more, like some kind of compensation, would require you to prove in a court of law that you was harmed by it in some way, other than just general stress & embarrassment.

Whether or not it may or may not constitute "sexual assault", or "molestation" would have to be looked into and dealt with by a qualified Lawyer specializing in this kind of abuse, and in my opinion you was abused and must have it investigated by the embassy, I believe the search may have been unlawful in it's nature, and that some of your rights may have been violated.

So, please don't let it go, as this could be very important to both you an others on here. If it was me in there, I'd be frelling-well going ape shit at them, and would not let them do the search, I'd rather them cuff me & chuck me in a cell for 24 hours, thereafter I'd go after them hammer & tongs through my embassy, and so should you my friend.

Good luck, and keep us informed.

Angelo.

"Chance favors the prepared mind"

pretty freaky shit man

i agree with Angelo, the embassy would be a good start.

saludos,
jer...

Well, it's not like I had to take my clothes off. I was just man-handled. But still, how would you like to be drinking a beer and have that happen. It felt like Franco's ghost.

I think I am going to write a story about it, so I'll definitely call the embassy for info. I am just shocked that no Spaniard I've talked to actually knows his rights about this.

Personally, I think it's pretty important to know when you don't have to listen to a cop. In the States, I would have asked "am I under arrest," waited for the "no" and walked away no matter what he said. If they don't have a reason to detain you, they can't.

I any case, I have no info on those cops and I am sure nothing would come of it anyway. I will find out what my rights are though and post them here. If anyone has any helpful info let me know.

Later gators

by the way, not that it matters with regards to your civil rights and all but just WHAT kind of places do you hang out in

not only have i never experienced such raids but i have never heard of them either.

saludos,
jer...

I have to agree with Jer on this one. Sounds strange to say the least. We are not blaming the victim, but I learned a long time ago to stay away from certain places and certain people.

Shawn

I won´t entertain any suggestions that I could be to blame for any reason whatsoever.

However, it does give me some immediate insight to what others will assume. This will help in the story I´m writing since I´ll have to fight against such assupmtions from the get go.

If anyone has any legal input, that is really what I am looking for with this post. Thanks in advance.

Phil

quote:

I won´t entertain any suggestions that I could be to blame for any reason whatsoever.

Great, because no one isblaming you. When writng your story, you should know how people think and the first thing that many people ask is, "What was he doing in a place like that?". Hey, it's human nature.

As far as legal advice, please state exactly what you are looking for. I read your first post and the last question you put out, but what type of questions, exactly, do you hope to have answered?

Shawn

I'm with MapMan, there shouldn't be a wrong place for the basic human right to privacy. This isn't a police state (anymore, thank god). He was in a bar in Malasaña, not in the street raving like a lunatic threatening people. I really doubt the cops were looking for weapons, in which case, there was no risk to public safety (except for those who got the huevos rotos treatment).

I think the law that applies to this sort of "cachear" is here:

http://noticias.juridicas.com/base_datos/Admin/lo1-1992.html (look around article 17 and google it to find more info)

Unfortunately, this sort of thing happens ALL THE TIME in the US, too. There, police officers do not need a warrant to do these sorts of searches, but theoretically must demostrate "reasonable suspicion," which is a pretty slippery concept (that keeps getting more slippery). The way this works out in reality is that almost anything goes if you happen to fit a certain "profile" or are near people who do.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terry_v._Ohio

In the US, once you allow the pat-down search to begin, you tacitly give your consent, so it's a matter of having the cojones to refuse to comply with the orders of a heavily-armed law enforcement officer--and very likely get that ass-kicking that you mentioned--or give up your right to privacy. Scary stuff.

I really think you should call the embassy and try to find out more about your specific situation. It will definitely make a great article. Maybe call some lawyers, too (I'll bet they would talk to you for free in exchange for a mention in your article). I think it's important, particularly for foreigners to learn what their rights are and think ahead about what they would (and should) do in a situation like this.

P.S. When stuff like this happens, you should ALWAYS ask to see the police officer's ID.

quote:

I won´t entertain any suggestions that I could be to blame for any reason whatsoever.

nobody is blaming you, that is why i wrote "by the way, not that it matters with regards to your civil rights and all"...

as someone who gives a LOT of advice to people coming to madrid, i simply thought it would be nice to know what kind of places to avoid.

you have to admit that what happened to you is pretty unheard of so i have a feeling the place you were in was "exceptional" to say the least.

i also agree with Shawn in that...

quote:

When writng your story, you should know how people think and the first thing that many people ask is, "What was he doing in a place like that?". Hey, it's human nature.

a good writer would prepare for these things.

saludos,
jer...

Is it okay for me to quote you guys in my article?

Thanks Mariposita! Great resources.

quote:

there shouldn't be a wrong place for the basic human right to privacy

I think the great majority of people who read this post will agree with you.

quote:

I'm with MapMan, there shouldn't be a wrong place for the basic human right to privacy.

Mariposita,

No one is doubting this, but we do have to remember that we are only getting his side of the story and that we were not there. That's a fact that simply cannot be disputed.

MAPMAN said:

quote:

squeezing my royal jewels unpleasantly, and tell me if this were America I would get a beating

Is this police brutality? How does one define police brutality? What exactly does it look like? How does it feel? What senses are involved?

We, especially as Americans, only see police brutality as the police beating someone excessively. Or in other words, videos that we see on TV and now YouTube and MySpace.

Once again, I am not blaming MapMan at all, but I know that he is only telling his side of what happened. We do not know what exactly prompted the events that led to the police entering where he was. Neither do we know how other people reacted that could've sparked the way in which he was treated.

If MapMan does call the Embassy, what exactly can they say or do if he doesn't have the officer's information? The only thing that he can say is where he was and what happened and do we really think that an investigation is going to be launched? I am all for taking action, don't get me wrong, but what is going to be accomplished after the fact?

I am looking at this objectively. There are certain questions that people are going to have.

quote:

When stuff like this happens, you should ALWAYS ask to see the police officer's ID.

Excellent advice.

Shawn

Out of curiosity, was everyone in the bar treated the same as you were?

I personally have always had good experiences with police, no matter where I've traveled (in fact one time in NYC a cop let me drive the wrong way down a one way road in order to get back onto the road I needed) but I seem to recall about a year ago Jer and Rocco having a strange run-in with some police in Sol. I've always secretly wondered if it didn't have more to do with my race, gender and nationality though (white American female- we can sometimes come off as rather stupid). That and I think I look really innocent.

If the cops had any "side" to their story, then we would have been arrested for doing whatever illegal activity that they thought we were up to, don't you think?